source: Sang from Yahoo Groups!

Derren Brown
by Ben Sloan, March 13th, 2003

METRO CAFÉ EXTRA
Are there regional differences in people's responsiveness
I don't know yet, we'll see when the tour starts. I was going to memorise as much of the phone book as I can in each place I go, and get people to test me with phone numbers of people they know.

How long does that take?
There's a lot of four or five-hour drives on the tour. I don't know, it may not work.

Have you done that before?
Yes, but the problem with it is that it's such a short-term thing. The only way to remember that amount of information is to have it in a thin veneer right at the front of your mind, so after about 15 minutes or half an hour it's gone. I'd have to refresh myself just before the show. You have to use a different process to remember that information for longer which isn't really as good. You can't remember as much but you retain it for longer.

The fast way I used for studying law, because I wasn't interested in the subject but I had all these cases to learn and a lot of very dry information, so I would sit and do that half an hour before the exam and it worked.

You also played paper-scissors-stone at Millwall's ground. Is that like David Blaine doing his stuff in the Bronx?
Yes, it was like that. But they weren't too bad. I needed somewhere people would be in a crowd mentality, and the most extreme point would be just before a match which was what I needed psychologically for the game to work. That's generally how it works, that same game wouldn't work at a dinner party.

Other than the casinos, have you ever used it to your advantage, like attracting a partner?
Again, yes, when I started. Anyone would, I'm sure, but it's not always as effective as people might like to think in those areas. As I grew up it became second nature and the temptation to use it became less and less. It becomes more of a performance thing. So yes, I have but it was a long time ago and I'm not proud of it.

Are some people easier to read than others?
You get people who are very open and responsive to it - they are obviously very easy to work with. Then you get people who are real challenges, who don't believe it's going to work, and they're just as easy, if not easier to work with because what I'm looking for is a predictable response pattern. Someone who's challenging is normally a lot more limited in how they respond. People who are difficult are those with a detached interest in it, who aren't that involved either. I generally avoid working with people like that, so it comes down to me being flexible enough. I need to pick the right person, so occasionally if I misjudge the person it doesn't work.

Can anyone do what you do?
Absolutely. I see it like any skill. Anybody can sit down and play a tune on the piano. If you put in a lot of practice, you become musical and you get a knack for it. And it's the same with this - you'd have to be the sort of person who wants to put a lot of work in but, essentially, it's something anybody can do.

How do I do it, then?
What it comes down to is doing the opposite of what we do when we communicate. If you have a conversation, your conversational partner is normally talking about themselves. You listen and you relate it to your own life and find your own anecdote and come out with that - so it's two people talking about themselves. In essence, what I do is listen to and watch what the other person is saying and build a psychological profile of them. That sounds like a serial-killer film, but you come in behind the other person, see what filters they have in place and how they see the world. You do that by listening and watching in a certain way. That's quite a vague answer but it's the basis. From that, if you get good enough, you see what patterns they have that are reliable enough to use for therapy or whatever. I happen to use it for entertainment.

What signs are you looking for?
It's almost an infinite number of things. It depends on what I want to do, but essentially it's unconscious clues and signals. A lot of it's verbal as well. I try not to break it down into anything I can slap labels on because that's the problem with a lot of body language stuff. You get too caught up in dogma that somebody's thought up - saying that when they fold their arms it means whatever. It's finding a loop where you're getting a responsive person. It's difficult to be more specific than that because it depends on the individual.

You studied law. You would have been useful in the courtroom.
If I had pursued law, I probably wouldn't have got into this in the same way. I decided this was where I was going to go and I put the effort in. I can't imagine ever wanting to go into law now, it's such a soulless and unpleasant job.

I had visions of you being a force of good in the courts.
I don't know, but I would have definitely been for evil.

You used to work casinos. How much of that is card counting and how much is people-reading?
It's a bit of both, but it's the person who's the weak link, where you get your hook in. Even if you're not winning any money they're very good at spotting when somebody's trying something on and you soon get asked to leave. In the new series we go into a casino undercover. I'm basically scamming them, explaining how I do it, but that was a step back. I don't do that any more.

Did you win anything?
Yes I did, but you'd have to watch the show to see what happens. I also went to Margate fairground and freaked out the ghost train driver on his own ride.

How did you do that?
I just talked to him about the ride, asked him if he enjoyed frightening people and tried to get him into a certain state. Then I got him to sit in the car, did a brief sort-of hypnotic induction on him and sent him through. He's quite a rough Scottish guy, but he came out with his eyes all welled up, saying: 'I am never going back in there again.' He was absolutely white and could barely talk.

If someone recognises you in the street, they must think you're casing them out.
Yeah, I was crossing the road in Bristol recently and these two girls walked past. Just as they passed I caught, peripherally, this flicker that they'd recognised me, but I didn't process that until I carried on walking and was about to turn a corner. I was thinking: 'They've probably stopped and turned round looking.' So, just before the corner, I turned round quite quickly. They had stopped and were staring. I caught their eyes and they screamed. It made my day.

Derren Brown: Mind Control is on Channel 4 on Fridays. For tour dates, log on to www.derrenbrown.co.uk